Notes on the VP Debate


Here are some of the thoughts I had as I watched the debate.

Where do they find these women? She isn’t ugly, she’s scary looking. She need to put on some weight. Why does her face look like that? She has that accent that drives me up the wall. Do the liberals know that they’ve built up this image that inspires disgust in others when they hear their accent and see their sunken faces?

Joe Biden makes the first promise they did not keep: protect the American people. We are in more danger today, thanks to Obama’s failed policies, than we were in 2008.

Wherever the facts lead you? It’s too bad the president doesn’t care about the facts, blaming the deaths on free speech rather than Al Qaeda.

This is an empty, shallow promise and threat.

It’s too bad Barack Obama doesn’t agree with Joe Biden. His priority has been to fundamentally transform America, not protect us. Biden then contradicts himself, putting priority on revenge, not security. If the last thing we need is another war, why did Obama entangle us in several new ones, without even consulting congress?

Ryan nails it: It’s a terrorist attack. Why wasn’t there a marine detachment protecting our ambassador — France has one! Ryan calls out Biden for FAILING to get an agreement. It was his job. “Let’s not lose the things we fought so hard to get.” “Let’s not project weakness abroad.” Benghazi is indicative of a larger problem, the unraveling of the Obama policy.

The moderator inserts herself in the first question, wondering whether it was appropriate for Romney to talk about Obama’s failures. Was it appropriate? Why does she think the American people even care about the media’s failed narrative?

Ryan points out that the Obama administration did the same thing (they did.) Biden laughs. Is he nervous? Did he just get called out? “We should’ve spoken right away when the Green Revolution started, when the Mullahs were attacking their people.” WOW! We should not impose the devastating defense cuts.

Biden interrupts, not even 10 minutes into the debate. Cuts off Ryan.

Calls Ryan’s observations “Malarkey”. Didn’t he just say, moments ago, he wants to get to the bottom of the truth? Says EVERYTHING Ryan said was inaccurate. Blames Ryan for cutting embassy security. Blames Gov. Romney for making a political statement before the ambassador was known to be dead. Doesn’t understand why we look weak. Says Obama repaired alliances. Says Obama brought China and Russia together to pressure Iran. Says Ryan bets against America all the time.

Moderator interrupts to change the subject to Libya. What was Biden first told about the attack? Biden blames the intelligence community. There’s an investigation. Claims ignorance about Libyan ambassador wanting more security. Says he wasn’t told, blaming his underlings. Blames their entire answer on the intelligence community. Blames Romney for dividing the country.

Ryan, should the US apologize for burning Korans, urinating on corpses? Ryan says yes. Says we should NOT apologize for standing up for values. We Should NOT say that dictators who hurt their people are good guys. When the commander on the ground says we need more security, we should send more security. This was 9/11 anniversary, we knew Al Qaeda was rising, and we didn’t even think to give our Benghazi security? Moderator interrupts Ryan again.

Iran: Ryan says Iran had the material for four years, we had four different sanctions,3 by Bush, 1 by Obama, watered down by Russia. Mitt Romney wanted sanctions since 2007. Only because we had bi-partisan support we could get sanctions. Iran is stepping up, attacking people throughout the world. Obama is sending out mixed signals. We need to change Ayatollah’s minds with unified, tough stance. Obama waters it down, is not unified. Biden laughs again. Romney will have credibility.

Biden: Could the Republican Congress do sanctions and get the world on board? What you want to go to war (Ryan: Prevent war.) I won’t talk about classified info. Toughest sanctions in history of the world. We know how close the Iranians are to nuclear weapon, we are on the same page as Israel, and they are far away. Talked about fissile material. They need a launch mechanism. What are they talking about? What more can Obama do?

Ryan: Let’s look through the eyes of the Ayatollahs. They see Obama watering down sanctions. They speed up refinement, and Obama doesn’t do anything. They see Obama going on a talk show rather than meeting with Israel. They see the secretary of defense walk back.

Moderator interrupts again: How do you change their mind? Can you solve this?

Ryan: We can debate the timeline. Interrupted couldn’t even answer the question. Points out that we need credibility.

Biden: Ayatollahs see their economy crippled, exports crippled, world united against them. The idea that we don’t talk with Bibi is insane. He talks to Bibi all the time. He knows exactly what is going on. Bunch of “stuff”. Sec. Defense didn’t walk anything back. They don’t have a weapon to put it into! Iran is more isolated today than when we took office. Totally isolated.

Ryan: Thank heavens sanctions in place, despite their opposition, 20 waivers. Biden interrupts, laughs.

Biden: Facts matter. Loose talk. Not true they can get a weapon. The world is behind us.

Ryan: When the Sec. Def. says we can’t go to war, then the administration loses credibility. When they saw the Green Revolution, Obama was silent for 9 days. When they see daulight between Israel and US, they are encouraged.

Mod: Another war in the Middle East?

Ryan: Worst is a nuclear Iran, the biggest sponsor of terrorism (Biden interrupts), they call us the Great Satan, Wipe Israel off the Map. We can’t live with nuclear Iran.

Biden: War is the last option. Crippling sanctions. Calls Romney a flip-flopper. Iran is being crippled. Obama doesn’t bluff.


Unfortunately, the < 8% unemployment was a lie.

Can you get to under 6%? How long.

Biden: I don't know how long. Can and will. Facts: Economy was in free fall. Great Recession hit. Lots of bad stuff. Rescued GM. Cut taxes for middle class. Romney said let Detroit go bankrupt. Romney said let foreclosures happen. Says 47% are unwilling to take responsibility for their lives. Ryan said 30% are takers. These people are my mom and dad and neighbors, pay more in income tax than Romney. They are elderly who live in SS. They are veterans and warriors who don't pay taxes. It's about time THEY take responsibility. They should be signing a pledge to level the playing field, give the poor a fair shot again, not have different set of rules, not to hemorrhage tax cuts, $5 billion to a bunch of families. Take responsibility.

Ryan: We're from similar towns. Joe's town has 10% unemployment. 8.5% when he came in. (Biden interrupts.) Yes, they inherited a tought situation. (Biden laughs.) 1.3% growth, slower than last year, getting slower. "We're heading in the wrong direction." 23 million Americans struggling or work. 15% are in poverty. This is not what a real recovery looks like.

5 point plan: energy independence by 2020. Deficit/debt controls. Trade. Champion small businesses. (Biden laughs)

Mitt Romney is a car guy. This is a guy who helped a family he didn't know who suffered a terrible car accident. Took care of college. Mitt doesn't tell these stories. It wasn't cash help. It's his time. Gave 30% to charity, more than the two of us combined. Mitt gives his time.

About that quote "I think the vice-president knows, sometimes the words don't come out of your mouth the right way." (Audience laughs)

Biden: "I always say what I mean." Laughs. The crowd laughs at him.

Ryan: We want to get people out of poverty, help everyone succeed. Self-sufficiency. Opportunity.

Biden: If you think 47% is a mistake, I've got a bridge to sell you. Appreciate ROmnay's service, I know what it's like. I sat in the homes of people who go through what I went through. People want to know you've been through it. I don't doubt Romney's committment to people.

He had no commitment to the auto industry. I've never met two guys more down on America than these two guys. If they'd get out of the way and let us pass the tax cut, make it permanent, if they get out of the way, let us keep people in their homes. Stop talking about how you care, show me a policy, show me a policy where YOU take responsibility.

They talk about the recession where did it come from? Blames the wars, blames the tax cuts. Biden voted against that stuff. Now they care about the debt…

Ryan: Let's not forget that they came in with one-party control. They had the ability to do eeverything of their choosing. :ool at where we are now. THey passed the stimulus, borrowed all that money, spent it, said unemployment would not be above 8%, 4% growth, it's never been there. Mod interrupts. That's what our plan is. VP was supposed to oversee the stimulus spending, it's been wasted. 100 criminal invstigations. Wasted on green energy,.

Biden interrupts, no evidence of croniness. Love our friend —asked for money for companies in Wisconsin.

Ryan defends: Advocating for 2 people asking for grants.

Biden: He said it would create growth and jobs. Congress said it was a model, less than 4/10 of % waste or fraud. Not one single evidence of fraud and corruption.

Ryan" Was it a good idea to buy windmills from China? Was i a good idea to spend China's money?

Bide: Moody's said it was the best thing to do. We've got a better track record than investment banks.

Ryan: Where are the 5 million green jobs?

Moderator moves on to medicare. Will programs have to change for medicare to survive?

Ryan: Absolutely. These programs are going bankrupt. They have to change. I know what these programs did for my family. Helped me go to college. Helped mom go to college, start a small business. She paid her taxes on the promise that these programs would be there.

You can change the program for 54 and younger, guaranteeing it, without changing for 55 and older. Chief actuary of medicare said Obama double-spent $700 billion. 15-person board, making decisions for our medical care. Social security 25% cut kicks in when it goes bankrupt. Biden laughs. They haven't put any credible solution on the table. Guarantee younger people coverage. More coverage for poor and middle class. Les for rich. We want people to decide, rather than 15 person.

Biden: Death panel fro Palin, now here? We saved $716 billion, cut cost of Medicare, stopped overpaying. AMA AARP endorsed what we did. Extended medicare to 2024. Ask seniors: do you have more benefits? You do. You get $800 more medicine. Their plan wipes it out in 2016.

CBO siad it would more for every senior when they got to retirement, but he got all the republicans to vote for it, ROmney would sign it. Believe who? AMA? Me? Or Ryan, who added $6,400 more to medicare?

Now they have a new plan: folks trust us! they say. Their ideas old and bad and eliminate the guarantee of medicare.

Ryan: They got caught hand in cookie jar of Medicare. Their own actuary came to congress say: 1 in 6 will go out of business. 7.4 million Seniors will lose their coverage of $3,200 benefit. Biden interrupts.

Ryan turns to Biden. "Mr. Vice President, I know you're under a lot of duress …" Biden laughs "Hahahaha." "I think the people will be better served if we stop interrupting each other." "Well, don't take all the 4 minutes then!"

Ruan: We're saying Don't change benefits for 55 and above!

Mod interrupts: What about those who can't make up the difference? Voucher?

Ryna: 100% coverage for poor people! Take down subsidies for rich, give to the poor. That $6,400 was misleading, totally incorrect now. This is bipartisan. Biden interrupts "Not one democrat supports the plan." Ryan: "Our friend from Oregon." Biden: "He no longer supports it."

Ryan: We put it together with former Clinton budget director. Biden: disavows it. Ryan: From the Clinton commision to save medicare.

Ryan: If we don't if this problem soon, current seniors will get cut!

Biden: If they allowed medicare to bargain for cost of drugs like medicaid, that would save money. Ryan: Deny them choices. Biden: They are not denied! They are not denied! Have you been denied choices? Ryan: Because it's working right now.

Mod: Why not very slowly raise the retirement age?

Biden: WE did that with SS in 1983. Tip O'Neill, Reagan. If everyone makes a sacrifice, we can make it solvent to 2033. We will NOT be part of any voucher program. Mom! Go shop for coverage! It will not keep pace! If it did keep pace, no savings. We will not privatize social security.

Ryan: Nobody is proposing a voucher. Barack Obama said, "If you don't have any fresh ideas, if you don't have anything to run on, paint your enemy with a broad brush." Let younger Americans have a voluntary choice. That's not what Romney's proposing: old people keep their benefits. For younger people: Don't give rich benefits, raise retirement age slowly.

Biden: Romney plan, many studies say, is you'd get less money. Cutting benefits without taking other actions is absolutely wrong idea. These guys have not been with Medicare, social security from the beginning. Who do you trust? Them who wanted to increase $6,400, or us?

Ryan: That was completely misleading. Biden: That's a fact! Ryan: This is what people do when they don't have a record to run on: Try to scare people. Overtalking. Medicare did so much for my family we are not going to change it.

Biden: You are changing it. Poor people can't afford it.

Ryan: That's why more for lower-income, less for higher-income.

Moderator: Who will pay more in taxes, who will pay less?

Biden: Middle class less. Millionaires slightly more. Continuation of Bush Tax Cuts for wealthy should expire. We see no justification to 120,000 families will get $5 billion in tax relief. We want to extend permanently middle-class tax cut. These guys won't allow us to. We want a vote. They're holding middle-class hostage to the super-wealthy. They want another tax cut of $5 trillion, to give $250,000 to wealthiest, raise taxes on middle class. This is unconscionable. The last thing middle class need is this.

Ryan: Our entire premise of tax cuts is to grow economy and create jobs. We think government taking 28% is enough. Obama wants 44% of small business income. If you taxed every successful person and small business over $250k at 100%, we'd run government for a few days. Their aren't enough rich people to tax to sustain the spending. When they say they will tax the rich, the tax bill ends up as middle lass. Canadians dropped tax rates to 15%, average is 20%, president wants 40%! This tax would tax 53% of small business income, 700,000 jobs. It doesn't even pay for deficit.

We say lower taxes across the board, close off loopholes to rich, lower spending.

This $5 trillion plan I propose? Discredited in multiple studies, even their own campaign manager admits it's not correct.

Moderator: How will you pay for 20% cut? Specifics?

Ryan: We want to be bi-partisan. Look at what Reagan and Tip O'Neill did. We want to work across the aisle, so we only have a framework. Deny the loopholes to rich, lower taxes across the board. (Biden laughs) We want to work with congress. Six studies guarantees the math adds up.

Biden: Let me translate. Reagan gave specifics. 97% of small businesses make less than $250k. What are the others Hedge funds. How sincere are they? Gov. Romney, you pay 14% on $20 million is that fair? Yes, he said. Those guys will cut loopholes? The carried interest loophole, the capital gains loophole. The reason all these studies say they will tax the middle class is to cut the mortgage reduction, college deduction.

Ryan: He is wrong about that. You can cut tax rates by 20% and still preserve the cuts for middle class. Biden: It's never been done before. Ryan: Jack Kennedy did it. Biden: Oh, now you're Jack Kennedy! (Audience laughs.) Ryan: You work with congress, you fill in the details, that's how you get thing done? Biden: The republican congress? You're going to work with them? Ryan: Romney worked across the aisle, and it worked. Biden: If he was so good, why is MA even contested?

Biden: Let tax cuts expires on the millionaires! They do not need the money! Middle class people need the help! Why does he cut the tuition tax credits!

Ryan: Close loopholes on high income people.

Biden: Can you guarantee that you won't close mortgage deduction? 97% of small businesses make less than $250k!

Ryan: The tax taxes a million small businesses who are our greatest job creators.

Mod: Defense budget?

Ryan: We're saying don't cut defense. They propose a $478 billion cut to defense. There is another cut on the horizon. Moderator interrupts.

Biden: $2 trillion dollars.

Ryan: Don't cut it by $2 trillion dollars. If these cuts go through, the navy will be smaller than WWI. Don't impose devastating cuts.

Biden: We don't cut it. That was part of a debt deal they asked for. HE said "We've been looking for this moment for a long time." Ryan: We've been looking for bipartisanship for a long time. Biden: Military doesn't need this stuff. They want a smaller military. Joint chiefs of staff. They made the recommendation first.

Moderator: Afghanistan.

At this point, I am losing interest. It looks like the rest of the country has as well.

Biden goes from laughing to angry. He can't wait his turn. He invents his own strawman, even though his opponent is sitting right there. He lies. I can't stand it anymore.

Ryan has run circles around Biden intellectually. I don't know what he could've done differently to keep Biden in his place.

Update: The internet is making fun of Joe Biden. The one redeeming political factor in his favor was that he was a sincere, nice guy. Now that's gone. He's just a drunk, bitter uncle who can't make sense.


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